Emma Jones Phillips

Looking at Coronavirus from a Naturopathic Perspective

This interview with Emma Jones Phillips, head of the Cardiff school of Naturopathic Nutrition, goes into comprehensive detail on what is actually happening in the body when a virus takes hold. Emma explains to us the principles of cellular health, and the Bechamp theory of the terrain. She tells us why, from a naturopathic perspective, v* ccines could be damaging, and why five *G is also damaging on a cellular level.

We get into chronic health conditions, how they develop and even become fatal, and why people with chronic health conditions are more susceptible to the virus.

We also get into naturopathic techniques to support immunity, and why actually we can hope for positive outcomes from all this.

Personally, one of my biggest issues with our current situation is the lack of clear information around health, and how to stay well. There is a wealth of science which explains what is happening on a cellular level in the body when a virus attacks, and so how to protect ourselves from such an attack, and this is rarely shared. I felt Emma was the best person I know who could explain this coherently and accessibly, and I hope you find the information in this interview empowering. You can listen to it by clicking the link below, or read the transcript underneath.


Kate: Hi, Emma, thanks for joining me today.

Emma: Okay, thank you for having me.

Kate: It’s my pleasure. Well, we’ve been having lots of WhatsApp chats and I feel like you have really, super valuable and interesting information to share. So, I wanted to get a comprehensive insight into your understanding of health and viruses and all that kind of stuff. So, maybe you just start by telling us a bit about yourself and your work and what you do.

Emma: Okay, thank you. I practice as a naturopath and I run the School of Naturopathic Nutrition in Cardiff with my husband, Steve, and I’ve been involved in the naturopathic work since the early 90s,  I met Barbara Wren who was a naturopath in 1994. And that journey started with me having lots of health issues myself. So, it was very inspiring because actually I resolved all of my health issues within a very short space of time, then decided to study with the college and in ’96 studied and spent about seven years working alongside Barbara for 10 years in total, but seven years training, and then went on to work in various colleges throughout the UK, and then eventually set up my own naturopathic school in Cardiff in 2005. So, it’s been really wonderful over the years to really get that experience but also to see patterns within people and histories, and what works and what doesn’t work. I really have found over the years that the combination of the raw food diet, the naturopathic techniques, and also using specific supplements, like essential fatty acids, for example, really supportive for the transition into health really, and I think it’s possible for everyone. So, that’s where I’m at. I currently practice; I still teach people to become naturopaths and at this point in time, I feel really privileged in one sense to know what to do, and really inspired to help people with this. Because over the years, as you’ve probably found, Kate, it’s been a journey and it’s almost like everything is accumulated at this point in time where we’re really using this information and spreading that awareness in a much bigger way now.

Kate: Yeah, so, let’s just clarify, I always say Barbara Wren is the person that inspired the current wave of interest in naturopathy, would you agree that she’s been the most influential person to spread to the naturopathic understandings in the past couple of decades?

Emma: Absolutely. I really feel that. For me, it was, she was a lifeline for me, because my life had come to a standstill at that point when I met her, I had chronic fatigue and I had a history of anorexia actually as well, and so, the transformation that occurred was so incredible, and also then seeing how so many other people were transformed in her presence and she’s 80. So, she’s been working in this field for 50 years, I think 40 or 50 years actually. She’s written a couple of books and she really is an inspiration and she’s passed down that knowledge as well as other people like yourself, Kate.  The raw food movement has had a tremendous effect on how people have changed over the years and got their health back.

Kate: You said you set up the college in 2005. So, you must have worked with a lot of people yourself in that time.

Emma: Yeah, absolutely. And just had so much change in people really with the techniques, the combination of the naturopath techniques and changing diet. And as I said earlier, the patterns that go on in people’s bodies in terms of ,there’s a particular sequence of events that often happens when people get ill. In the same way that if we know what that understanding is, and what that sequence of events is, we can actually retrace and then undo that. So, the belief system within this approach is that if we can find a way into illness, there’s always a way out. There is always a resolution and it is just putting that work in. So, that we can fully understand what’s happening and also really heal the body in the true way rather than just doing the sort of plaster effect, really. You know, medication or even sometimes natural medicine can be used as a sort of temporary fix if we don’t look at diet, diet is the core of helping people to get to that true health picture

Kate: And lifestyle, right? There’s so much you can do.

Emma: Yeah, absolutely.

Kate: Okay, let’s dive in then. Can you explain to us from your naturopathic standpoint what’s going on when a virus enters the body?

Emma: Yeah, so a virus actually needs a particular set of circumstances in order to be activated. So, as we all have gathered up to this date, there’s many viruses around us all the time. And it’s actually the temperature in the body, the balance of pH, the cutting off of oxygen, that allows that virus to actually spread for one to a better word, or activate. So, we can have viruses in the body and actually have no effect from them. But it’s only when we’re in a situation where we’ve become dehydrated. Maybe the diet isn’t the way it should be. Therefore, the cells throughout the body aren’t cleansing sufficiently and also the temperature. So, the virus will activate in the body, if there’s actually not a normal body temperature So, they don’t actually survive very well in heat. So, if we get heat to the body, other lifestyle habits like exercise going on, we can actually change the temperature within the cell and change the pH as well.

So, I think it’s interesting to look at Bechamp’s research, the Pasteur / Bechamp argument is really interesting, because Pasteur’s theory was actually at the time, the sort of basis of the medical establishment view now. So, what he said was that viruses even though they were all around us, that actually the only thing that would solve us or save us then would be antibiotics and vaccinations. Pasteur was the person who sort of propagated that and then there was another guy around the time during this time and all this virus question was being done back in the 1950s, actually.  Bechamp said, actually viruses are around us, but we’re not to be afraid of them, they’re actually there to help us. So, a virus is there to heat up and clear the toxicity within the cell. So, actually, the temperature, the body temperature, and the clearing that goes on at a cellular level, is actually there to help us to be able to create detoxification. So that our cells become clear and therefore we gain more vitality. So, he re-established actually, the viruses actually were helpful in certain circumstances as long as we treat them in a specific way as in nurse the temperature without suppressing it, and also to go through that detoxification.

So, what Bechamp did, he took this evidence to Pasteur who was actually on his deathbed. And Pasteur said the time “I’ve been wrong, I actually, I agree with you,” died, and then the medical establishment published Pasteur’s theory over Bechamp’s, and Bechamp’s work was actually destroyed. So, it’s interesting that the theory that we currently have around viruses is actually one that’s untrue and it’s been propagated over 50 years really. And we’re actually working from an old script, we work from a situation where we don’t fully understand all the viruses properly and how to treat it. And therefore, there’s all this fear. The fact that we can catch it in the way that we’re told we can and actually in a body that’s got a great pH, if a body’s alkaline and If the oxygen levels are good, viruses can’t touch us. really. There’s no possibility they can survive within the body. Does that make sense?

Kate: Totally. So, let’s get straight into v * ccines then. Can you tell us a little bit about your understanding of why v * ccines might not be the best way to approach health?

Emma: Yeah, it’s a big subject, isn’t it? And people often get quite emotionally charged around it and again, I think is because often people aren’t looking at the real facts, or they haven’t done the background reading on how this sort of way of working with disease has come about really.

So, the first thing really is to talk about my own history in terms of v * ccinations, and how it would have affected me and some of my family members that have had effects of v * ccines. So, for example, with myself, I was fully vaccinated as a child, my parents didn’t have any information to say otherwise, and in terms of childhood diseases, I had them quite bad. I remember just being ill year after year, until the point I decided when I was 12 years old, that I would go vegan, and actually changed my diet and once I gave up dairy, actually, I never really sort of had any colds or viral things after that, until I got into my 20s, which again, was dietary related in terms of the toxicity levels at that point causing the ME. So, there was a really big turning point for me at 13, when I had BCG, and it was so noticeable that some of my family members said, you weren’t the same person since that point, you know. So, going into the teenage years feeling healthy, and then suddenly having the BCG and it really knocked me down and it gave me sort of glandular fever type of effect. And a low grade general vitality. That was the first point where we really noticed in our family that there was an issue with vaccinations, and then, because the next generation then, went on to have children, this is before I had my own children, some of my cousins had the MMR vaccine for their children and actually two of those children actually became autistic, literally overnight. I’m not talking, you know, it was a gradual thing. They were healthy children and then suddenly, they had the autism literally the next day after the vaccination. It was a very definite proof to us that if someone has a particular history where there’s maybe predispositions to certain things in the family, or that there’s been a history of not such a great diet, they are more vulnerable. The combination of predisposition, diet, lifestyle, then cause these children to be autistic, and really noticeably autistic.

That was quite a big learning curve for us in the family, and set me on my journey to explore the vaccine debate, as we call it. What I found along the way was that the more you dig into the into the theory of v * ccines, the more I found there was no evidence that they work. Actually, it’s the contrary, the v * ccines actually were causing more effects than the diseases themselves. I started to uncover what were the side effects of these, and what I noticed with my students, when I was teaching them, we asked all our students one year to look at their get their medical notes and actually look at the points where they’d got ill, and they’d gone back to the doctor for a particular problem, and it was usually within two weeks of every vaccine in adult v * ccines. In childhood v * ccines, there’s often repetitive trips to the doctor with your issues, eczema, inflammation, and for some people, it’s much more severe. So, it’s not a mild symptom that’s come from a v * ccine. It’s a really severe reaction just like with family members, that’s happened to my family. I’ve done a lot of background research over the years, I’ve seen and experienced clients’ reactions to vaccines, and it’s brought much more awareness and I think the most recent thing in my observation has been flu v * ccines and the effects of them.

For example, the flu vaccine has a lot of mercury in it and other chemicals, which the medical profession actually say these chemicals have to be in there to preserve the vaccine and in older generations who are having the v * ccine, they’re actually getting issues which I’ve noticed and have many people have reported, where they’re actually getting mental health issues after. Because we know that Mercury is a neurotoxin. It’s really sad that older people are getting this v * ccine year after year of a certain age and their mental health is deteriorating, and I’ve had a couple of clients where they went down the road of flu v * ccine and became Alzheimer’s or other memory issues, which we reversed with diet, eventually. But it did bring a big problem for them. The sad thing about childhood v * ccines is that now, whereas, when I was younger, we might have had under six v * ccines, up to six at the most, by the age of 10. Now we’re into 20 plus v * ccines and the recommendation for more. When we v * ccinate, especially repetitive v * ccines, the body goes on fight or flight and it’s almost like the body doesn’t know how to switch that off. So it puts that person in a very vulnerable state because they’re in stress mode, continuously. And if you repeat that year after year, depending again, on chronic illness where there’s huge inflammation, or there’s autoimmune issues going on. For some people, it’s really hard to reverse, it’s years of damage, this is the worrying thing. I do encourage my clients to, to actually record their side effects, if they’ve had one with a yellow card at the GP and if you do that, it actually does become a statistic. If you don’t do that, if you tell your doctor then it doesn’t get recorded. Therefore, it doesn’t become a number or a sick, because many people aren’t reporting their issues because they tell their doctor and the doctor sort of just pushes that view aside, and says It can’t be that and therefore, they don’t get that sort of understanding then or nowhere to go really, in terms of something has happened to them, you know.

Kate: Can you explain to us a bit more about what’s happening on a cellular level, and you talked about the cells using a flu as a cleanse. Can you explain that to us a bit more, why a v * ccine would suppress that?

Emma: Absolutely. So, the theory within naturopathic nutrition is that when we have a cold, it’s the body actually releasing internal mucus or internal toxicity. And the theory is that the body is always working for us, it’s never working against us. So, if we have a cold, or if we have a temperature, or a cough, it’s our body’s natural signaling, to give us a cue that we need to actually do something about our lifestyle and our health in order to become fully healthy again. So, the clearing usually happens between three to ten days, and it’s called an acute cleanse. And actually, if we deal with that, well, if we nurse ourselves through natural methods, the idea is we come out of that feeling more well than we’ve ever done really, than we’ve ever before we went into that particular illness and those events will often happen around seasonal changes. So, like the spring equinox, the autumn equinox is the most powerful one. And I think it’s really interesting that this whole virus episode, this endemic actually started around the spring equinox. And So, the body was having that natural clearance for many people, especially as many people more than ever, in the UK, went for flu v * ccine during between September and December. I think that particular equinox for people, they weren’t naturally clear. And so children aren’t really allowed to have those colds, or they don’t have the energy to have those clearings that they’re meant to have, in order to get well. What the v * ccination is doing is actually putting a lid on that, it’s putting the body into fight or flight. The body has no energy to cleanse, and that cleanse then, is suppressed. So, it goes deeper into something more chronic. If we don’t treat those symptoms in a very natural way, even things like paracetamol for example, it actually stops, put the lid on the natural inflammation process, which then suppresses the fever, which then pushes that toxicity into a deeper place, in terms of the body. And the typical thing around this sort of virus that we’re dealing with is actually pneumonia. That’s the side effect of suppressed temperature and so the question is, we’re looking at if people were taught how to nurse their bodies naturally, again, we were to sort of avoid all this. But this idea that, if we v * ccinate year after year, we’re going to get rid of colds and flu is just laughable, really, and scary because people aren’t actually having those cleanses that they naturally are needing to have in order to stay well. So, I think you’re leading into the Coronavirus. We’ve had an issue where, flu v * ccines have been massively pushed through five years or so, more now than ever, in the younger generations and the older generations. And they actually even do repetitive flu vaccines now, where it might have said every year, they were saying in the older generation every six months, and therefore, how would that person ever get over that level of toxicity?

When I’m talking toxicity, I’m not just talking about suppressing the body’s natural cleanse, but also the additives that go into v * ccinations. And for example, I mentioned Mercury, but actually there’s much more difficult things in there. Even worse than Mercury is MC, which is aborted fetal cells.If the aborted fetal fails and then it forms a DNA, which cause a huge immune reaction. For some people, the body doesn’t actually recover from that. It stays in a place of suppression. So, then, if they have natural colds, or they have natural clearing, they haven’t got the energy, to do that cleanse, and therefore they get into a chronic state with lung issues, or for some people brain issues, because it’s going much deeper.

Kate: Like you said, there’s a lot of debate around vaccines and I totally agree, I think it’s lack of education and people not really being given the right information about what’s actually happening in the body and what a vaccine is actually doing. And I would say it’s actually a really similar situation with five *G as well, is that it’s been labeled as something that conspiracy theorists talk about without having a really good conversation about what is happening in the body as a result of putting these radio waves into the air. So, I’d like to get into that next. Can you tell us a bit about what your understanding is of how these kinds of EMFs are affecting us on a cellular level?

Emma: Yes, thank you. Yeah. So, yeah, the five *G sort of debate is quite strong, isn’t it at the moment. And I’d prefer to call it a ‘truth theory’ really. Because rather than a conspiracy theory, actually, there’s been 26,000 reports saying this five *G’s actually a ‘killer weapon energy’ You can find that information on the Bioinitiative Report. What’s interesting is that even though we have the proof that it is a potent energy that is not going to be helpful for anyone, there’s still a suppression of the truth around it. Ignoring the truth, even though these reports have been there. And the reason why we know about these reports is that armies and particularly in Russia, they use this particular frequency to actually harm people. We know that it’s used for warfare, and it’s also been used for crowd control. The frequency is so severe that people actually want to run away from it, want to get away as fast as they can from that energy and what it actually does Kate is, it cuts off the oxygen from the cell. We were talking about earlier how important oxygen is for cellular health. And five *G penetrates the cell, almost like a needle effect into the cells. So quickly that it’s like what people are describing with the Coronavirus, this sharp pain that they get in the chest, oxygen cut-off feels like that. There is this shooting pain within the lungs, and also, it’s interesting that it actually affects hemoglobin. So, there’s two things happening, the hemoglobin is being robbed through the process of five *G, hitting the cell, and then the oxygen supply is cut off. So, that person has very quick symptoms and quite serious symptoms from that and it will affect different people in different ways. Because not everyone, as I said, has got the same health story. It may be one person, it may be really severe effects because of their health history and for another, it would be like a slow poisoning, over a gradual period of time and through our work, we’ve got techniques that we use to protect from certain frequencies but with the five *G actually, what’s interesting is it’s  the combination– that we started off with 2G in 1991 and that was 1.9 gigahertz and now we up to 95 gigahertz with five *G . So, it’s really huge levels of exposure to microwave waves more than we’ve ever felt on the planet. It’s an incredible thing to be dealing with right now alongside everything else. I think it’s had an impact in a big way in terms of the places whereas had they’ve had five *G, they’ve had quite a lot of issues around the Coronavirus. We could highlight those but all the information’s online in terms of where those places are and what the effect was of five *G. It’s interesting that why we need to be fighting it is because, it’s not conducive for us long term and I really hope that eventually it will be banned because the long-term effects for everyone is going to be quite disastrous. We will find a way to cope with it, the people who are interested in health and will have devices and dietary solutions, but not everyone has access to that, Kate. So, in those cases, people are really struggling or will be struggling much more, if it does get rolled out fully, in the way that the governments are saying they want it to be rolled out. There’s so much evidence, 26,000 reports that say, that is not good for us. I think we need to almost flip it and say, Okay, show us something that says ‘it is okay for us.’ you know? Because it’s not okay. There’s some schools of thought that say actually, where there’s been a pandemic, and you can actually look at the graphs online, there are graphs to say that there’s always been some kind of release of microwave frequencies. It all links up even as far back as in when we had the Spanish Flu, 1918, that was the first rollout of microwave frequency.

Kate: We are electrical beings, right? All the things that happen in the body, happens by electricity, right? So, it doesn’t make sense that electricity in the air wouldn’t affect our internal electricity.

Emma: Yeah, absolutely, it’s an accumulation point for us, isn’t it? We’ve had 2G, 3G, 4G, now we’re into five *G. And this electrical smog that we’ve all been living with and not understanding has gotten to a critical point, really. Where hopefully the five *G campaigns have brought awareness not just to five *G but to electromagnetic pollution, generally. Because,  over the years I’ve met so many people who’ve had electromagnetic illnesses. My husband was one of them when we first met, and he had been living next to a cell tower, for a year or so, and it totally debilitated his health. These sort of effects on people are quite hard to reverse if people don’t have the access to natural medicine, because the medical establishment has really don’t have an answer to it.

Kate: So, I’d like to go a bit deeper now and just go further into your understanding from a naturopathic perspective of how chronic health conditions develop because of suppression in the cell in the body, not able to do the kind of cleansing work they need to do. Can you go a bit deeper with that and actually explain how that connects into inherited toxicity and also then the medication that people are receiving. If someone has a chronic health condition, like heart disease or diabetes or cancer, how the medication that they would receive from a conventional doctor could actually escalate the condition?

Emma:  When we’re born, we actually have an inherited health picture from our parents and our grandparents. We’re really not born with a clean slate in terms of perfect body, perfect health, we have inherited imbalances already. And then, how we are nurtured when we’re little, especially between the ages of 0-7 really affects our lifelong active health, things like how we were born and breastfed and where we vaccinated or not, that all has an impact and that then builds the picture over time of how our health story builds up. So, one example is if a child is not breastfed, and then they’re put straight on dairy, cow’s milk, there’s some side effects of that, such as repetitive sore throats, mucus in the system, etc. And maybe that child would then be given antibiotics. So, that therefore the body does not naturally heal, but it may go deeper, and another side effect of the dairy industry is eczema. One example would be if you put steroid creams on eczema, it will usually then develop into asthma. So, we can see the traveling of illness going deeper towards the head as we progressively get worse with our story, if we’re using suppressive medications, etc. So, in direct link with what’s happening now with Coronavirus, we’ve got when people have lung issues, they almost definitely will have in their history, IBS or bowel disorders somewhere. Even if it’s not in that generation, it may be in the previous generation. We know in the traditional medicine theory that the colon is very, very connected with the skin, lungs and the mind. So, in this case that we’re looking at now, with the virus, people will have a predisposition to lung issues, if they’ve got bowel issues, IBS, difficulties with bowel in the family history, or suppression of skin issues, as I said, using creams that may be suppressed in eczema, psoriasis, those types of skin problems and then it goes deeper into the lungs. And that’s the root the body naturally takes, it goes deeper into the being, the individual, so that eventually it sits at the lung level and then we put in a suppressant like antibiotics or anti-inflammatory, etc. which then goes deeper into the person’s makeup. So, we’re in a really chronic state then because we’re right up to head level in terms of the toxicity levels, does that make sense?

What we describe as the metal element in the Chinese system is that particular connection with the mind and the colon or the lungs to the colon. People with lung issues, there would be a huge predisposition to metal issues, what we call the colon issues, skin issues, lung issues, mental health issues, and that is all connected to the bowel in the Chinese system. If the body is trying to cleanse with a temperature, or cough (remembering the dry cough that people are getting is linked with lack of oxygen), and the body doesn’t actually get what it needs, the oxygen or the right natural treatment to bring that inflammation down naturally. And then put in something like paracetamol which in France actually they’ve proven this and they’ve temporarily put a hold on people using paracetamol and ibuprofen because they know that if you put those into a body that’s already struggling, the toxicity levels go deeper or to a certain degree, the inflammation process goes down and then it’s suppressed so that the body can’t have that clearing. The symptoms there then when the anti-inflammatory go in or the painkillers, the symptoms go deeper into the person’s being, then you’ve got a chronic life-threatening situation where there’s less oxygen, there’s more acidity, there’s more dehydration. There’s a cell that’s really dying. Basically, every cell of the body is cut off from oxygen and the lungs that are really showing up in distress with that.

I think in relation to heart disease, it’s a deep inherited story really with heart disease. It’s something that we don’t build up in just one lifetime, it’s inherited stories from our family members and diet and lifestyle over long periods of time. It just doesn’t come out and out of the blue, it’s rather there as a sign to tell us do something quickly. It’s quite high up in the body. So, things that are actually more superficial would be not the major organs, basically. The skin for example, or the bowel is quite superficial area to have a problem. But if we start getting into heart and lungs, we see it as a much more chronic issue and something that we need to do something about quite quickly. Otherwise, that person gets into a lot of distress with their health. And, of course, if that is not treated in a way that’s nurturing, that person then goes into a very deep state of disconnection, we call it an atrocity or chronic illness. I guess we can also link vaccinations with autoimmune issues. And we know this because I’ve seen reports where in the unvaccinated, the autoimmune issues are actually almost zero, they’re non-existent. Whereas in the vaccinated they’re very high, the actual figures– I’m not sure off but I know they’re quite tight just because of my work. You know, I meet so many people with autoimmune disorders.

Kate: I think you’ve done a really clear job so far explaining how a virus can impact people negatively and how a healthy person wouldn’t have anything to fear from a virus. This research showed in both Italy and Germany. In Italy, they said that over 99% of people that had died from the virus had pre-existing conditions mainly heart disease, cancer and diabetes. In Germany, it’s actually showing the same thing. So could you explain to us why in your understanding that would be the case, why those particular pre-existing conditions would make people more susceptible?

Emma: The first thing would be medication. The body is already compromised with having to deal with medication. And also, what got those people into cancer or heart disease situations would have been back to diet and lifestyle. That person just doesn’t develop cancer overnight or heart disease overnight. It’s a very long process and remembering the body’s always trying to help us. So, the signals would have come long before the heart disease or the cancer, but often people are not wanting to change, and medication is just stabilizing but not healing the situation. In those cases, it’s the pH has changed, and the body’s in a state because of dehydration and cellular lack of oxygen as we spoke about earlier. So, the cells throughout the body will often be cut off from oxygen and compromised to start with. Then if you have a further stress, remembering stress dehydrates, and I believe there’s been a lot of stress with this virus and not just the physical effects, but the emotional effects and the continuous information that were being given through the media. This has an effect on people on their stress levels. And I think If you put stress in the picture alongside a diet that’s not good and medications, then it’s just at a tipping point where the person can’t cope. And they’re not able to have what were described earlier is that natural cleanse. That natural clearing in which for many people, I’ve been speaking to people and people who’ve had that temperature and that cough, healthy people, which may need to have that natural cleanse, they’ve got over it within five days. Whereas for those people who are on medications, they’re really feeling that they can’t get over it because they haven’t got the energy to overcome that, or the vitality.

Kate: An interesting bit of information that I found out at the beginning, which I think just got completely buried, but when I was researching it in the beginning, it’s medically defined as a self-limiting disease. The definition of a self-limiting disease is a disease that in the vast majority of people will naturally run its course without medication, and just pass. So, the fact that it’s defined medically as a self-limiting disease is very counterintuitive to the measures that have been put in place, right?

Emma: Yes. Yeah, exactly.

Kate: And the other thing that’s also very much up for debate is how they are getting the statistics for the people who have the virus, both who have the virus and who died from the virus. Can you tell us a little bit about what your understanding is, about how they test for it and how they decide who has it and who dies from it?

Emma: Currently from what I am reading, the way that where people are tested is actually antibody testing. And antibodies actually tell us that the body’s fighting something. So, it doesn’t actually test for viral activity, it’s actually testing for the body’s defense system, and is it on fight or flight, as I described earlier. So, people can be on fight or flight if they’ve previously had a vaccine. Usually someone would be on fight or flight within six months of having a vaccine. So, flu vaccines that happened during wintertime, that sort of fits into that bracket. And there’s been some links with the flu vaccine and those antibodies in the system. So, the body’s in a state where it’s showing viral activity, they’re sort of stating from antibody testing, but we don’t actually know its Coronavirus. So, many people will have antibodies reactions right now, because of stress, because of diet, because of five *G, because of vaccinations. It’s not a clear test in method, currently. And as the result we’re getting, I think fake numbers really. The numbers are increasing, but yet, are they real cases?

Kate: So, I think it also really relates to– I remember working with you in in Wales in 2013. And there was a measles outbreak at that time. And I remember conversations with you then about how that was managed. You work with so many people, right? You’re so involved in the local community, and you see really clearly about what’s going on within the community. Can you tell us a little of the story of what happened in 2013?

Emma: Yes, So, what happened was that actually, in 2012, the government had realized that MMR take-up was 67%. It had actually dropped from 99% in 1995 to 67% by 2012. People were starting to realize there were reasons to question MMR. As a result, rather than making the vaccination mandatory, which they didn’t want to do, there was a propaganda campaign which made people fearful to actually go out and get this vaccine that maybe they haven’t had, and some people got it twice. I think there was something like 1800 extra people that got vaccinated. As a result, we did have measles going on in Wales and it wasn’t nowhere near an epidemic and it was made out to be an epidemic at the time, because everyone who had any sort of symptoms related to what they thought might be measles, it was a big scaremongering thing going on in the newspapers etc. Everyone became a statistic who actually went into hospital thinking they might have something in relation to measles. As a result, the numbers increased over a period of time where they were collecting false data, basically. Eventually it did get aired and was published that only one person actually died of measles and that person actually was an alcoholic, and he had other health-related issues, so, he didn’t actually die of measles. I think it was interesting because at the time, there was a big panic and people were falsely made out to feel that they had to go and do the vaccination. The vaccination actually created the epidemic. Actually, we didn’t have many cases before that happened. And there was an increase of measles during that time, but it wasn’t any anywhere near what we thought he was in relation to what we’re being told through the newspapers, and the television?

Kate: My understanding is that, that’s what they’re doing now, right? Is they’re saying that people who have the virus are dying of the virus when they were already very ill, right? In the same way they were saying, you could die of measles when you can’t die of measles. You can only die from complications caused by measles. And with the virus, you can’t die of Coronavirus. You can only die of complications from having pre-existing conditions with the virus, with these suppressive treatments.

Emma: Absolutely. And I tend to sort of as we as we all do in the natural health field, sort of listen out for the stories in relation to this and I can think of three stories directly linked with people, friends of friends or clients of family where they have had really severe complications. One person’s grandmother was very ill anyway. And she also was wanting to– she was on her way out basically in terms of wanting to die and basically it was written on the death certificate actually, Coronavirus. And the family, said it wasn’t true, you know. So, that’s one example. Another example was a 33-year-old woman. She was a niece of a client and also had extreme severe complications and actually had no sign of the Coronavirus. But the Coronavirus went on the death certificate. So, in these situations, the families have been really distressed because they just know for a fact it wasn’t true. That’s just two cases that I know of.

Kate: And the fact that they medically induce comas, I find that really disturbing. Can you explain to us why they would consider that would be a treatment?

Emma: I think from a medical point, the theory would be that they are helping the body to recover the lungs, by taking the stress off. But actually, if we break that theory down, it’s actually the reverse, that the body is under more stress in that situation, because we don’t have our own natural vitality when we’re under an aesthetic or induced coma. So, it’s interesting methods, but ‘pacifying’ someone for a short time until there’s actually space to deal with it, to actually deal with the real issue.

Kate: I’ve heard a lot of people not being close to death and then being put into a coma and actually that’s what–

Emma: Yeah, yeah.  Exactly. The body doesn’t have its natural vitality in that state; therefore, the symptoms will go deeper. The person actually in that state, probably makes a choice to leave the body. I just think it’s inhumane.

Kate: Well, despite all this, I do feel so positive at the moment, and I feel like all of this is going on, and it can only serve to increase people’s awareness of the body and how it works and cellular health and all the things that we both are so passionate about and believe in. You’ve been so articulate in saying, the body has this natural intelligence and the body is always seeking to heal, the body is always seeking to reach its optimum state. And actually, there is so much that we can do to support the body in that. So, I’d like to go there for a bit and just talk about solutions. Can you tell us what you feel if people are in good health? What are the best things they can do to support themselves at this time? And then more so, separately for those who feel they might be vulnerable because they have autoimmune issues or chronic illness conditions, what would be the best things for them to do to support themselves?

Emma: The first thing really is hydration and diet. To have the body in a place where it’s receiving a lot of antioxidants and in that position, the raw food diet is better for that than anything and so, juicing and smoothies and good quality water and making sure that food is prepared naturally and of plant-based origin, in order to bring the vitality back to the system. Supporting through alkalinity, and again, the raw food diet has alkalinity and color for the antioxidants. And so really working on the antioxidant levels and hydration and vitality will raise the body’s energy in a very natural way.

That would involve avoiding things that are animal based or heavily processed, glutinous foods for example, high sugar. People who well are generally following this sort of lifestyle, I feel. The next stage for them would be incorporating naturopathic techniques. And I feel these are the magical tools that will really take people into a state of higher wellness, what I call the high place where people can actually feel like at their best, rather than just energy. And I know you really feel passionate about naturopathic techniques as well, Kate. And I really feel in regards to my own health and some of my clients’ health, they probably wouldn’t have come out of strong illnesses without naturopathic techniques. So, some of these examples would be castor oil treatments on the liver, on the lungs, if you felt there was a weakness there. How that works is you actually make a compress and apply it directly to the area for at least one hour and three consecutive days in a row, ideally over a period of sort of three weeks or so, and that strengthens and cleanses the major organs, and you can actually put castor oil anywhere on the body, you can actually rub it all over and have a bath, you can put it directly, useful to do the liver. People who haven’t done that before, as a starting point. If there was a problem with lungs, you’d actually do lungs and liver and say, consecutive days, and also enemas. They’re really quite a powerful naturopathic technique. And many people will say, oh, you know, I don’t want to do an enema, but actually when they do, it’s quite transformational in terms of how the energy improved, how the lungs clear, how we cleared much faster way. And so, enemas are used quite a lot in our approach alongside simple things like using Epsom salts in the bath, a large amount of Epsom salts. Again, you might use this method under supervision. You wouldn’t use it if there was a temperature, but it’s actually very, very good for aches and pains. And for someone who’s actually feeling like low energy, it’s very energizing. I think for temperature that probably the best ones would be cold therapy. So, doing like hot and cold showers and cold baths and even simple techniques like a flannel along the forehead, cold flannel. People have gone so far away from natural methods. Now, they reach for things like Calpol or Paracetamol to bring down a fever, over cold flannels, you know. It’s simple technique, but quite powerful. If my children have had fevers at certain times, I’ve always done the cold method on the head and then cold socks on the feet, wet socks on the feet, and that brings the temperature down really quickly. So, the simple methods can be very effective and sort of moving on to people who are in a more chronic state where they’ve got complications, seeking guidance of a health practitioner in the field of naturopathy, or in the field of nutritional coaching can make a big difference. But simple things would be actually cleaning up the diet very gradually, bringing in juicing, and also starting to do some naturopathic techniques very slowly so that they can build up that vitality and also release some of the toxicity. And it may be that that’s over a longer period of time, rather than just sort of all at once. Homeopathy also comes into it, to treat symptoms if people are in a chronic state of health, rather than actually do a medication and they can be very effective. And one of the techniques that I’ve used a lot for people with the dry cough is the neti pot, have you tried this Kate before?

Kate: Yeah.

Emma: So, you use a neti pot  [ or salt inhaler ] which is empty and then you don’t add water but you add salt, pink Himalayan salts, and three, three to five drops of iodine. So, potassium iodide, and you would put that onto the salts and then cover over the neti pot and hold one nostril inhale the iodine, which then directly gets to the lungs and with iodine, it actually is such a purifier. It clears all pathogens it’s so powerful, it’s good for coughs and particularly what’s been happening with this situation.

Also working on sort of vitamin C as a high level as well and working with antioxidants at a high level really help alongside on some of the things that you’ve been recommending Kate, the apoptogenic tonics, the mushrooms and anything that’s apoptogenic will help the body to heal, and that can be very good as well. But the naturopathic techniques are really magical, they really make lasting change happen really quickly. And I’ve had situations where, for example, one of my client’s mother’s, really, she felt that she was dying. It was the situation with her lungs, where it was really extreme. And she put a compress on and she left it on her. And she recovered in 24 hours. So, it was really quite a big turnaround. And really, we didn’t know whether it would work or not, because this lady was medicated, and wondering actually was it her time, you know? But actually, it was really transformational. And this is a situation where this woman didn’t even change diet, which she’s elderly and not wanting to change that much. And the compress actually turned the situation around, So, it can be very good. I’m constantly hearing about stories actually, where people have used natural foods and naturopathic techniques where they’ve turned the situation around quite quickly.

Kate: I’ve got so many stories with Castor oil. I just think it’s so overlooked and people, much prefer to go out and buy some potion or something. It is the simplest thing and so many times people have said to me, oh, I’ve got this thing. And I’ve tried all these things and nothing works. And I’m like, have you tried Castor Oil? And they’re like, no.. And then that’s the thing that shifts it.

Emma: Wow, yeah, I just totally have faith. And what it’s actually doing at a cellular level is deeply cleansing the cell, but it’s actually raising the frequency of that organ So, that organ then can respond in a much more vital way. And yeah, it’s really overwhelming sometimes how much it does change things. So many people have had benefits from over the years and most recently, doing the compresses on the lungs on the liver or if there’s not enough time to do that, just rubbing it on and going out in the sun or into the bath for 20 minutes

Kate: Or in a sauna.

Emma: In a sauna, yeah, yeah.

Kate: So yeah, like I was saying, I just have a very positive feeling about this time in particularly, when I do my meditations, which I’m trying to do every day here in Bali, I’m getting really beautiful meditations and really, high frequency stuff coming through and seeing this as a big—it’s kind of like a savasana, I think is like a rest between poses, and it’s really a chance to– I feel like we’re experiencing a frequency upgrade and this kind of enforced rest is giving us a chance to really absorb those frequencies and when we come out of this phase, however we do come out of it, which nobody knows,  will be on a much more elevated frequency. Can you tell me about this from your perspective of what you know and understand?

Emma: Yeah, absolutely. Just like yourself, I feel better now than ever. I feel like there’s something that’s shifted during this time. And I’m actually encouraging people to call it retreat and self-reflection rather than isolating. I think ‘isolating’ seem like a negative word, you know? And So, the retreating and self-reflection allows people to see and feel where the missing links or the gaps are within their own lifestyle, and diet, really, and I think it’s really helping people to reconnect, to feel more grounded, to notice where their truth is and to actually slow down and feel. It’s often people are so busy that they they’re missing a lot of the cues which show us the truth or show us what our true potential is,  if we’re able to cook for ourselves naturally, and be at home and start to feel into that, it brings a much deeper awareness. So, the more I’m speaking to people, the more I’m hearing, actually, people are really enjoying this phase of being in this self-reflection and self-retreat. And what’s really interesting is if we look at the astrology, it’s almost the opposite has happened in the astrology to what’s happening in the media or the external version of what we’re seeing as the Coronavirus. Because the energies that are happening right now, we’ve just actually moved into the Aquarian Age at the beginning of March and it coincided with the equinox and that’s often described as the golden age or the age of enlightenment and in this phase where there’s more photons coming in, more light particles coming in, through the planet. And if people want to read around it, it’s described as the ‘Photon Band’ which means that actually, we have access to heal in truth, awareness and connection much more than we’ve ever had. Actually, we were last in this space 26,000 years ago. So, it’s actually quite an exciting time for change and it’s a time of uncovering personal truth, planetary truth, get into, get into know ourselves more deeply to see what our personal path is, or our true purpose is to really connect with consciousness. So, meditation as you said, is so lovely at the moment and so many people are saying they’re meditating and they’re also doing group meditations and distant healing and this is the time for natural medicine to come into its own. And that’s why, you know, it is called the ‘Golden Age’ And I really believe that it’s the starting point for us as collectively to get into that place of more balance and shaping a different future. The planetary sort of alignments right now is all around alchemy and creating our own reality. So, the truth really, is this we can actually create a different world from this point because it’s like a reset, it’s like a reset of everything that we know of, and people are off saying often it would be great to get back to normal, but I kind of thinking we won’t have a normal, afterwards. There’s it’s been a huge sort of social collapse on every level and I think when you get that type of breakdown, you get huge breakthroughs, in that process. So, for me when I read around the astrology when I connect in the way to our case, I feel this excitement, which is a strange feeling because of course it is a lot of distress happening at the same time and there is a lot of uncovering of, I guess darkness or getting to the truth of what is the core of what’s happening. But I think if we can hold that healing for ourselves and to change being us, you know, individually, there’s going to be such a different outcome for this.

Kate: It’s a global healing crisis isn’t it, when you have the childhood diseases like chicken pox and measles, then the child who’s allowed to go through it naturally has a big growth spurt afterwards, right? And I noticed with all my boys when they got any of those childhood illnesses that afterwards, they would be drawing in so much more detail, their writing would improve, their speech would improve and I feel like this is what it is, we’re in the disease phase. But out once we come out of this, there’s going to be just such a massive growth spurt.

Emma: I think that’s really a nice way of seeing it and it’s true. When people go through the healing, the crisis, as you said, there’s huge healing at the end of it. And that just really exciting, that’s going to go manifest into reality once we come through this sort of phase that we’re in. And So, I think if people use their minds and, their meditations, their affirmations around shaping the future that they want, and focus in on that, and to really get ourselves in a space where we are in creation rather than breakdown. I’ve noticed it with my children as well. They’ve gone through huge spurts of change and transformation during this time, and they’re in different places as well. So, it’s happening, you know, with much younger children as well, not just adults. Even if people aren’t having those acute clearings, there have been a clearance on an emotional and mental level as well, they’re all really healing at such a deep level.

Kate: Amazing, Amazing.

Emma: And I think just lastly on that, talking about electromagnetic frequencies, the planetary frequency is changing so rapidly and this has been documented, whereas we would have been at a certain resonance before. Now we’ve moved into a much higher frequency and that’s been documented in the moment, in terms of the planetary beats and the vibration that we’re in planetary and I think that’s a lot to do with meditations as well as so many people are meditating, so many people are focusing on healing, there’s a big shift happening.

Kate: Yeah and I appreciate your knowledge and information  so much in the way you can articulate it in such a calm and easy to understand way.

Emma: Thank you.

Kate: It’s been brilliant to have that kind of clarity around information and just for me, this is one of the biggest parts of what’s been going on is just the lack of clarity and information and it’s all been, it’s funny to me because all the people who claim to have the science and the logic, they’re the ones who are the most illogical, right? They don’t have the scientific backup for their argument. I really wanted to speak with you, so we could really get into some of the facts around natural health.

Emma: Thank you. I’ve really enjoyed speaking to you, it’s just really great and it actually is quite calming when we speak about it in this way, where we know that actually the change comes from ourselves individually, you know. That’s where the peace comes in, I find that when I’m listening to different views, through the media or through reading online, I sort of check in with myself and say, how does this feel? And to feel into what gives peace rather than what gives stress. And I think that’s a good truth through radar for me to be able to understand, if something resonated or not really.

Kate: And what’s empowering  because this is problem with the modern medical system, is it’s fundamentally disempowering and in that system, there’s no support for the person to understand their own health better or do things to take responsibility for their health and so that’s why that system is so broken right now, because there is such fundamental disempowerment in it and when we have the information to understand really what’s going on in our bodies and how we can support our bodies best, that’s so empowering, right?

Emma: Absolutely, I just know that that’s where the change comes, when people know how to treat their bodies, when they know how to look after themselves. The empowerment in that is just incredible and that’s really what’s so brilliant about this work with dietary changes and lifestyle changes. People really feel it and that is really the difference. So, yeah, the empowerment is everything. Someone understands how they’ve got ill and how they can resolve it; they can do anything is totally the key to every time I find.

Kate: Brilliant. Brilliant. And can you tell us, if people want to find more about your work if they want to take any of your courses, or what you’re offering anything online at the moment?

Emma: Yes. So, we’re actually doing webinars which are on various subjects in relation to what we’re talking about, immunity and all sorts of things, really. We’ve got a backlog of recordings if people want to listen into those, and also where we’re running our naturopathic nutrition course online currently, which is a one to three year course, and that actually allows people to qualify by the end of it, so they become a naturopath. It’s for people who want to do it for themselves, but also people who want to get that qualification or deeper learning and that starts again in September. We’re doing workshops during the summer and also the seminars which are weekly to link in and also personal consultations. If anyone needs to have a one to one, you can contact us and So, you can find that information on We are based in Cardiff, and yeah, people can consult over zoom or telephone, if that works for them. And also, you can find us on Facebook and Instagram, and yeah, all the other sort of social media methods.

Kate: Emma, thank you so much for your time. It’s been brilliant.

Emma: Thank you so much. Really love speaking to you, really appreciate it. Thank you.

You can book personal consultations with Emma here and with Kate here.



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Kate Magic